Episode 78: Communicating in a Crisis with Chris McCloud & TJ Winick, Part 1

00;00;09;05 – 00;02;14;16
Michelle Colosimo
Crisis really announces itself – a workplace accident, an act of violence, a data breach, the sudden loss of a leader. Organizations often have minutes, not days, to decide what to say, who should say it, and how to say it. In those moments, leaders face difficult questions. What do we actually know? What do we owe our own people first? And how do we speak honestly when the facts are still coming in? I’m your host, Michelle Colosimo. Throughout my career, as Empathia’s Executive Director of Critical Support Services, I’ve had the privilege of standing alongside organizations in the first hours and days after a crisis, helping leaders care for their people while the world is watching. My guests today are Chis McCloud and TJ Winick. Both are seasoned crisis communicators, and I’m pleased to say, are Empathia’s new Crisis Communication Experts. Both are former reporters who spent years covering crises from the outside before moving to the other side of the microphone. Between them, they bring decades of experience reporting on and advising organizations through some of the hardest moments those organizations have ever faced, and a clear sense of what earns public trust in a crisis and what destroys it. Over the next two episodes, we’re going to explore what makes the difference between a crisis response that works and one that falls apart – why the first hour matters so much, the common mistakes organizations make, and why arriving with empathy before information is so important to protecting a brand’s public trust. These conversations matter because no organizations are exempt. The question isn’t whether a crisis will happen, it’s whether you’ll be ready to speak clearly, quickly and humanly when it does. Please welcome Chris and TJ. So let’s start with you, Chris.

00;02;14;19 – 00;03;19;15
Chris McCloud
Thanks, Michelle, I appreciate it. So I kind of cut my teeth in public communication. As a former radio and television reporter. I covered general assignment for for several years in politics for about ten years. State government, municipal government, things like that. I spent then ten years as the director of communication for a large state agency here in Illinois, where I live under two different governors during that time. Also during that time, I worked in state emergency operations centers and on site disasters. Many times during during my tenure in in government. So I have a lot of experience in, you know, on the ground crisis, on the ground disasters, things of that nature. And then the last 15 years I’ve worked in contract communications and PR, working with a lot of different public affairs clients and regulated industries like higher education, aviation and and health care.

00;03;19;18 – 00;03;42;07
Michelle Colosimo
So you’ve got a lot of experience and a lot of background and crises- I mean, it’s a broad definition, right? And really what that means, and we always say to when you’ve seen one crisis, you’ve seen one crisis because they’re all different in their own ways. So looking forward to diving deeper with you and sharing those insights. But before we do that, TJ, why don’t you tell us a little bit about yourself?

00;03;42;10 – 00;05;44;28
TJ Winick
Thanks, Michelle. It’s great to be with you and Chris. I spent two decades in broadcast journalism at the beginning of my career, including time as a local news reporter in Florida, in Pittsburgh and my hometown of Boston, and then as a national correspondent for ABC news, where I reported across platforms including Nightline and Good Morning America and World News. So I’ve been on both sides of the camera during the worst moments of an organization’s life. But my time in journalism is what led me to advise clients on navigating reputational threats, where I now advise corporations, nonprofits, colleges and universities on how to navigate crisis and issues management. And I actually wrote a book a few years ago called Reputation Capital, because I kept seeing the same pattern when I was reporting on a crisis or an emergency or a simmering issue. And that was organizations that had done some real good in the world were losing the public’s trust, not because of what happened to them, but because of how they responded. Right. Reputation. I found it’s not built in a press release. It’s built over years, and it can be spent down in a single afternoon if leadership freezes, hides, or gets the tone wrong. And so I certainly see my job as making sure that doesn’t happen. So when it comes to crisis communications, as you said, every crisis is different. There’s no two crises that are alike. But there is a playbook, and there are best practices which we’re going to talk about today, obviously, on how to respond that so that you can maintain or rebuild trust that perhaps you’ve lost during a crisis.

00;05;44;29 – 00;06;13;27
Michelle Colosimo
It’s taking those learnings, right. What can we look back at things that have happened to organizations in the past, and what can we learn from that to better ourselves for the future? And, you know, again, yes, you’ve seen one crisis. You’ve seen one crisis. They’re all different and unique in their own way. There still are threads that go through that, that you can pull from it to help and build yourself to being prepared as best as you can, right, for that crisis. Chris-

00;06;13;29 – 00;06;37;22
TJ Winick
-absolutely! There’s human capital. There’s financial capital, and then there’s reputation capital. And as legendary investor Warren Buffett has said, it takes 20 years to build a reputation in just a few minutes to to lose it. So if you think that way and you prepare that way, then you’ll be in a better position to respond when when it’s necessary.

00;06;37;26 – 00;07;36;06
Michelle Colosimo
And, we’ll call it the recipe – It’s not difficult, right. When you when we get down to it and we talk about, you know, what are those critical things that you need to do that are important to do. It’s not overly complicated. It’s, you know, doing the right thing while also within the limits of what you’re able to do. So let’s get started. Let’s talk about this, Chris turning over to you. You know when that first hour, right. Post crisis is really critical that can make or break what people will perceive, if they will trust you, or if they’re going to look to other means to be able to get information because they lost your trust, their trust in you. So what do you think are really the most important things organizations should be prepared for when you’re looking at that first hour? Because time is of the essence.

00;07;36;07 – 00;10;54;24
Chris McCloud
You’re exactly right. And and just to go back to a point you guys were talking about just a minute ago, when you say, you know, it’s not hard, it isn’t like the process is. And you know what you should do and when you should do it. The variable that makes it difficult is the actual crisis, the environment in which you are operating set. Can cloud judgment, and that is why it’s so important to be prepared and be unified, so that when a crisis hits and you know around you is breaking down, you have a plan to refer to that you developed not during the turmoil, but in in moments where you could think properly. So there are definitely some, some important things that that organizations should, should be prepared for. First of all. And these are pretty simple. Confirm facts before you speak. Verify what is known, what is not known, what you’re doing to find out. Don’t speculate on causes or casualties or certainly blame certainly in that in that first hour you you should also notify employees first, or at least simultaneously. Your employees should never learn about what is happening to their organization, from reporters, from the media or in our environment. Now, social media, it’s just everywhere. And it it bleeds into all things. Speak with a unified voice, you know, activate your your crisis team and a single chain of command immediately that’s already been determined so that a designated spokesperson is controlling the messages, outbound messages that are going out on your behalf. Make sure you get an accurate and this is important, accurate holding statement together as soon as you can, you know, acknowledge the event, express concern for people affected. And importantly in this comes from, you know, my my time as a reporter. TJ can certainly relate to this as his time as a reporter. Set some expectations, let them know you’re going to update them, and when you’re going to update them, even if you have to come back to, you know, to a group of reporters at a specific time and say, hey, we don’t have any new information, you are still being accountable to them, and they will acknowledge the fact that you are being, you know, being accountable. Obviously, you want to monitor social media, traditional media to, you know, try to catch as many rumors or misinformation as you can. And then generally, I would say this, this might be as important as anything. Show up with empathy before you show up with information, because people are going to judge your tone, especially in that first hour, long after they forget the details of what has happened in this crisis.

00;10;54;27 – 00;12;03;17
Michelle Colosimo
Correct? I mean, we talk about that all, all the time. People aren’t going to remember exactly what you said, but they will remember how you made them feel and that will stick with them for sure. You know, the other thing, too, that I think is important to acknowledge is in the past, before social media, before all these different outlets that people could communicate on. You had time. You had time from when the crisis happened to when you had to communicate. And that is gone. Right? Everybody who has a phone is an individual reporter. As we’ve seen, stuff is getting posted while the crisis is happening or in the middle of that crisis. So back to the point I was making earlier. Time is of the essence. You don’t have that ability to plan and identify in the middle of it what you’re going to say. You have to jump on it and you have to communicate it, and you have to create that trusting source. And if you aren’t and you don’t get ahead of it, people will go elsewhere to get the information.

00;12;03;21 – 00;13;08;27
Chris McCloud
Yeah. And and in some ways, I think it makes it easier for a company to be honest and be. And when I say tell the truth, I don’t mean in in lieu of lying. I just mean you should assume that people already have visual evidence of whatever has happened. Now you have to guard against visual evidence that never happened. That is that has been made up out of thin air. So those are different things. So but my point is, in the past, you know, before everybody had cell phone cameras, before, you know, everybody had a mouthpiece immediately. You’re right. Companies organizations had the ability to huddle and talk because the flow of information to the public was so much slower. And it is now immediate. And in many ways, you are playing catch up as an organization, even if you are the most prepared and have a process down and know who’s going to say what, etc. you are still a lot of times playing catch up.

00;13;09;05 – 00;14;22;10
TJ Winick
I certainly concur with everything that Chris said. And, you know, I would just add, as you talk about the sort of 24 hour, you know, media cycle that needs to be fed, I mean, silence in that first hour really can read as indifference, even when it is really just caution. So, as Chris said, having a whole, you know, having a statement if it doesn’t say a lot because facts are still being gathered to acknowledge the situation, to acknowledge that, you know, you are gathering information, that you are caring for those impacted is is critically important because the first hour, as you’ve been discussing, is really about, you know, it’s about containment and credibility. Yes. Not not about perfection. Yeah. And so, you know, you’ll you’ll be able to share more information as it happens, you’ll be able to demonstrate the transparency and accountability that your stakeholders are looking for. But you know, when you are responding to a crisis that’s unfolding, you know, that’s usually not possible in the first hour.

00;14;22;13 – 00;14;51;09
Michelle Colosimo
Information is power. Right. And so you’re trying to help in helping people regain some sense of control by getting information, even if the basic information is we are working on getting information, as soon as we have it, we’ll be sharing it. You know it doesn’t. You don’t have to have every specific detail right then and there because it’s unfolding right. And things are changing very rapidly and you’re trying to get that information, pull it together.

00;14;51;11 – 00;15;25;20
TJ Winick
Also about owning the narrative in your own crisis, you know, you should be the most credible source of information when it’s when it’s your own, you know, again, crisis or emergency or issue that’s being reported on or being communicated on. And as we all know, there’s an information vacuum. And if you don’t fill it, others will. And sometimes it’s going to be critics and sometimes it’s going to be the least charitable voices out there. So you really do need to to own the narrative and drive what people are consuming.

00;15;25;23 – 00;15;44;16
Michelle Colosimo
I would say, you know, to kind of recap what we’re saying you’re discussing here is speed matters more than perfection. At the end of the day. TJ, I’m going to turn to you. What do you see as the biggest mistakes organizations make when communicating about a crisis publicly?

00;15;44;21 – 00;19;11;03
TJ Winick
Well, we’re talking a little bit about this on our pre call. But I think the most common mistake. There are a few, but one of them is leaving out those like Chris and I whose experience and expertise is in reputation management, keeping folks like us from contributing to that first public statement. You know, maybe it’s the CEO, maybe it’s general counsel or an outside attorney or the chief people officer. You know, legal language is built to protect an organization in a courtroom down the road, right? It’s not built to reassure, let’s say, a frightened public or employees in the next couple of hours. And the gap between those two goals is where trust can really erode. I know we’ll talk about that more, but another mistake, I think, is going silent when there’s an internal investigation which which leaves a vacuum like we just talked about, that speculation and bad reporting will often fill. And so even if something is happening internally, if it’s deemed that the public or if other stakeholders are going to require steady communication about that, that issue, then you know, you need to honor that. I also see organizations over apologize for things that are not their fault or under acknowledge harm. That that clearly is. And I think both read as tone deaf. I’ve spoken a lot about this. I think that there was a knee jerk reaction by a lot of organizations to just apologize. But of course it can be like, you know, the boy who cried wolf, which is if you over apologize, people aren’t going to interpret it as sincere when you really do need to apologize. And I think we all need to take a breath and understand what situations call for maybe explanation, and which situations call for a genuine apology. And then I think too often I see leadership disappear almost entirely after a crisis. You know, sending out a statement, certainly, but with no name attached and no face attached to it. So, you know, people don’t want a press release in a crisis. Of course, it all depends on the nature. If you’re talking about, you know, the public being at risk, if you’re talking about, you know, bodily harm, they want to see a human being speaking responsibly, you know, with empathy and accountability when necessary. There are certain situations where a press release or a statement without a name attached to it may suffice. But if we’re talking about, again, a, you know, a crisis, an emergency, dealing with transportation or dealing with some sort of infrastructure or real estate, often a real voice, a real person stepping forward doesn’t have to be the CEO. Could be someone else. But acknowledging what occurred, acknowledging how those folks who are being impacted are being are being supported can be critically important.

00;19;11;06 – 00;20;12;12
Michelle Colosimo
You know, and something I thought of as you were talking, TJ, I think, is who are you communicating with? First, you’ve seen where those who are impacted and their family members. There may be oversight, meaning the organization is jumping to get to the media to communicate out and missing the opportunity to address those impacted and getting them the information they need first. And so that while the intentions are good, right? Because hey, if we get out to the media, we’re getting it out to the masses that can be perceived by those who are impacted as a negative. Because why didn’t you come to me first? Why didn’t you communicate with me first before going to the media? And is there a you know, how would how do you approach that? What do you what do you suggest and in how do you help an organization navigate through that?

00;20;12;15 – 00;21;31;14
TJ Winick
Well, first of all it’s all about stakeholder mapping, right? Different audiences need different messages depending on what they care most about. Right. Employees are typically going to care about different things than, let’s say, customers, clients, the public, regulators. You know, often employees want to know how is it going to impact me. And the other way to think about it, the way that we always think about, I guess, sequential or cascading communications is from the inside out. You always communicate from the inside out. Those closest to you receive the communication first. So, you know, employees, board members, if you’re talking about a college or university students, family is alumni, donors, those kind of folks, then you communicate with the public or with the media because, you know, as was discussed, you know, amongst the three of us here, if employees learn about something in the press, you’re going to have an issue. There’s going to be a serious loss of trust. And I know we’re going to talk about employees, but, you know, they can be your most valuable emissaries in a crisis.

00;21;31;17 – 00;21;33;23
Michelle Colosimo
Yeah. Go ahead Chris.

00;21;33;26 – 00;21;34;23
Chris McCloud
No. Go ahead.

00;21;34;27 – 00;22;04;23
Michelle Colosimo
I was just a and obviously those who were truly impacted in that event, I mean, they are the priority, you know, depending. And it varies right on on the event what happened, who was impacted as well. It might be the employees that are that those that were directly affected. Or it could be a, you know, other stakeholders as well. But the key is, is making sure you’re getting to them first that they’re your priority.

00;22;04;25 – 00;24;45;07
Chris McCloud
You know, as we talk about employees and when to communicate, I mean, TJ’s exactly right. While all of your messaging should come from the same core philosophies, principles, etc., and preparation for crisis, they are different messages. You know, we a great example here, you know, that just happened recently would, you know, could be the Blue Origin disaster that that happened. You know, while employees weren’t you know, they weren’t, you know, physically harmed or, you know, or a part of that actual, you know, the actual disaster, their victims, their stakeholders, they need reassurance about, you know, their physical safety, their job security. What happens next? All of those things are in succession. They’re not going to get that information all at once, especially not in the first hour. So consistency is key, but they are your most credible, you know, messengers. And I don’t mean arm them with enough information. So any one of your employees could step up to a podium or a, you know, a gaggle of reporters and start talking publicly about what they know about the crisis, but they are able to to, to to convey and transmit correct information to family, to friends, to, you know, customers, etc.. And they need that information. So arming your employees with, you know, talking points and FAQs is, is really an important part of that of that process. Uninformed employees are going to improvise. They may speculate and they may not do it, you know, deliberately to spread misinformation. They may do it more, as you know, because it’s it’s an anxious moment. They are maybe being not maybe not being but feel pressure to hey, Joe, Sally, you’re involved in it. What do you know about this? And they feel like they need to say something to to their direct audiences when they may not actually have the right information to pass along. So, you know, making sure that your, your, your closest supporters and allies have at least enough information to, to help rather than, you know, hurt by speculating, etc. is is a real important part of of any, you know, crisis plant.

00;24;45;10 – 00;25;39;04
Michelle Colosimo
Well I think there’s there’s good intentions right, with employees and they’re wanting to do the right thing. And so and sometimes it’s filling the void. You know, I want to represent my organization well, but I’m not really certain what to say. But I don’t want to not say anything. Right. So there’s just this intent to respond. And and the flip side of that is to is, as we’ve been talking about, I mean, communication is key across the board. Right? And you have different stakeholders involved that you need to ensure that you’re communicating, communicating regularly. You’re communicating early. All of that helps build trust. Right. And also just the psychological safety around that too. You know, those are critical pieces in the beginning that are so important. And if you don’t do that and you don’t address it, it can have implications for you later.

00;25;39;08 – 00;25;40;17
Chris McCloud
That’s right.

00;25;40;20 – 00;26;39;08
Michelle Colosimo
Stay tuned for part two of my conversation with Chris McCloud and TJ Winick as we continue exploring how organizations prepare for, respond to, and recover from a crisis and the role clear, honest communication plays in all three. If your organization is thinking about crisis communication, whether you’re looking to prepare before something happens or you need experienced support on the ground in real time, Empathia can help. Our team works with organizations to build and test crisis communication plans, prepare spokespeople, and stand beside leaders during an active crisis. Visit www.Empathia.com to start a conversation. To hear this episode and other episodes of On Topic with Empathia, visit our website www.Empathia.com. Follow us on social media @Empathia, and subscribe so you don’t miss an episode. I’m Michelle – thanks so much for listening!